splendidbetta Posted October 14, 2006 Report Share Posted October 14, 2006 Hi All, I got an idea earlier today and I've been working it out all night I want to know what you think of it, and I would be grateful of any advice. As you can see, I face a few difficulties: The bottles may wear away the pond liner, and I'm thinking of using solid plastic sheeting on the floor of the pond to protect the liner. Also, the heater may melt the pond liner, and this could be fixed with the plastic sheeting. I'm also not sure about how else to keep the liner in good condition. The whole set up would be under cover. It might not need to have its own 'legs' if I can put the pond on a solid wooden bench. Carding so many bettas in this setup will be an issue too. Any easy-to-use suggestions? The Betta Barracks Pond is completely fictional at this stage. It is a possible future development. Thanks all in advance, Stefan :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie Posted October 14, 2006 Report Share Posted October 14, 2006 Hi Stefan I think it would tank a LOT of firepower to heat a pond in winter in Melbourne. Enormous heat loss from the surface will occur, as I found with my barracks, which is inside in the garage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc Posted October 14, 2006 Report Share Posted October 14, 2006 stephen this has lots of merot ...I have an indoor one and they are really the way to go for holding many fish this is a 3 foot one that holds 24 jars .. it is placed on beesser blocks and is bench height of 600 mm .I have a sheet of perspex that fits over to reduce evaporation. a three foot fluro light,a heater, and pump to circulate water .. [ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 Looks like a good idea Stefan, heating could be an issue in winter, but it would be great if you could time your spawns so that they wouldnt need to be jarred like that till mid spring when the temps are more stable. Is the water around the bottles just to heat them, or will there be holes in all the bottles for water circulation? just seems like a heap of water changes every few days! You could get a canister filter and suck water from one end and have the spraybar at the other so that you get water movement end to end, and to save the problem with the heater, get one or 2 of those inline ones that you attach in the pipes of the canister filter. Where would you put this? outside or in a garage? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splendidbetta Posted October 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 Heat loss will be a problem. The main idea for this was for the power head of the fluval 2 to push the water right down to the other end, which would keep it all circulated and heated properly. I could probably put styrofoam sheeting under the pond lining to insulate it, and have a glass lid with foam attached to that too to conserve heat and evaporation. But that would make it all more expensive. The canister filter and heaters is a good idea. It would have to house adults all year, including through winter. So the spring-summer jarring way you describe Phil won't work. It would be housed outside in a garage. If I'm lucky the garage will be closed up instead of open to the elements as it is now. If I'm even more lucky I will have my own room for a fishroom and can keep everything indoors and in one place. Marc, that is almost the same setup I have now. The reason I want a big pond version of it is so that I no longer need my 90L as an ageing tank. And because the tubs need their own heaters and the water inside them can't realistically be used in WCs. The fish will be in bottles. The bottles will be in the pond. Water will surround the bottles, and heat them. There will be absolutely no sharing of water between the bottles. ____________________________________________ Scrapping the whole pond idea...seeing as this would only happen when we move again, I might not need a pond/tub setup anyway if I can have a room only for my fish that can be heated with a room heater. But then I would still need to find another water storage container. I can't seem to make up my mind. I'm not in a hurry and I have lots of time for doing all this. Only immediate problem is that underbed storage containers only hold about 20 2L bottles each and need their own heater and that I have only 3 tubs :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celeste84 Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 that's almost the exact same setup as i use inside, but min is on a smaller scale i don't worry about a lid to prevent evaporation (though i do have one) because after three days they all get 100% water changes anyway (old water goes into the tub to top it up from loss of evporation, plants in tub clean water). question. why do you need the sand and pond liner at all?? if the water in the pond isn't going to be in with the actual fish, wouldn't it be much easier just to seal all the edges with silicon or whatnot, and then treat the timber to make it water proof? after a few weeks you could do a water change in the water in the tub to remove any chemicals that have leeches into the water; and after that it should be alright to use as a resevoir for water changes even if that's not a feasable idea, i think finding a way to make it all one piece and waterproof would cut down on costs, and you wouldn't have to worry about the heater damaging anything :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splendidbetta Posted October 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 Good idea celeste. What can I seal all the wood with? I dont want to treat the wood with anything toxic. All the surfaces will need to be sealed properly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marc Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 The construction material you could look at, could be marine grade ply for strength and longevity. I think that fiberglass could be used for a watertight liner. Not disimilar to a boat or large esky construction . it will be dear $$$ stephen...but not impossible Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splendidbetta Posted October 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 Interesting, but I don't want to break the bank. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berryfriendly Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 The construction material you could look at, could be marine grade ply for strength and longevity. I think that fiberglass could be used for a watertight liner. Not disimilar to a boat or large esky construction . it will be dear $$$ stephen...but not impossible Marine ply is expensive because it has an "A" grade face which is suitable for clear staining. I don't think in a pond stafan would need a clear finish. No plywood is waterproof and all plywood will weather, however most Australian plywoods have an A bond glueline which is watertight. So as long as you seal the plywood/paint it accordingly it will last longer. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splendidbetta Posted October 15, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 Thanks. If I end up not using liner, what do I paint/seal the wood with? I've never had to work with water tight/fish safe DIY before. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berryfriendly Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 I found a product in Bunnings just the other day. It is called Crommelin. Their website is www.crommelin.com.au I'm not sure how you would go about painting it on plywood/timber but you could always contact them. As for the outside of the barracks, to stop it from weathering you would need to give it a couple of coats of exterior paint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie Posted October 15, 2006 Report Share Posted October 15, 2006 IME of all the pond materials, liner was the cheapest. Back when I was building ponds fibreglass was a much more expensive option - presumably that remains the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celeste84 Posted October 16, 2006 Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 you could just oil the outide of the timber to stop the weathering - i think it's boiled linseed oil that they use??? you can pick it up in any hardware/paint place i'll ask my dad about what would be the best to do the inside with later (he owns/runs a hardware store) :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted October 16, 2006 Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 If it has legs, like in the picture, it will be easier to start a syphon, even though you are using a powerhead, but if it has legs and is higher off the ground it will also loose heat faster. You may also want to consider having 2x200watt heaters instead of one 300watt, incase one breaks and to get better coverage. Any waterproofing agent that is "food grade" SHOULD be perfect for fish. you may want to check out http://www.monsterfishkeepers.com/forums/ for ideas on sealing tanks and building them from plywood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callatya Posted October 16, 2006 Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 linseed can be a bit toxic, might want to look into it in relation to fish first. PondTite will seal it, its about $40 for 2L I think? That filter won't cut it. I have one, its great, but even if it slaved its guts out it couldn't filter with that much interference from the bottles. What is the point of having it? If its to keep the water moving, you'd be better off with a powerhead. If its for biofiltration you'd be better off with a UGF plate and gravel with base holes in the jars. If its for mechanical you might still be best off with a UGF plate and base holes but attaching an external cannister/sump to an uplift tube, or having one with two intakes. There are plans online for making plywood tanks, they were very common ages ago, with just one glass plate on the front. You should be able to adapt the patterns. http://members.shaw.ca/wmastop/bigtank/Startb~1.htm http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/diy_...d_aquarium2.php http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/load/aq...03721462.html?2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celeste84 Posted October 16, 2006 Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 if the linseed oil was on the outside, and something else protecting the inside, it wouldn't be a problem would it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splendidbetta Posted October 16, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 Thanks for all the feedback everyone. Theres more to consider than I thought I think I'll get a power filter instead then... But could I also have the fluval in there to actually filter the water through carbon etc? I don't want to get complicated with sumps and stuff. I think I might end up going with the pond liner. So where might I find solid plastic sheeting? I think I might put the 'pond' on a solid wooden bench... would that keep the heat? Cheers :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Celeste84 Posted October 16, 2006 Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 good luck and try a pool and pond specialist, or a large hardware store like mitre10 or bunnings for the plastic let us know how it goes, this could be handy for a growout pond in the summer LOL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie Posted October 16, 2006 Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 isn't boiled linseed oil non-toxic? Look in the yellow pages for water garden and ponds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
splendidbetta Posted October 16, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 16, 2006 It is OIL! OIL is no good for fish! From what I've read. Thanks ^_^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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