tlc33 Posted December 20, 2009 Report Share Posted December 20, 2009 Hi everyone, My son has given me a lovely xmas pressie, two beautiful blue rams. The guy at the lfs said that they couldn't be sexed at this size (approx3.5cm tip to tip). As I had no idea what the requirements for these guys were, I popped them in a 40L that has a betta girl in that I am conditioning. There are no live plants atm but plenty of fakes. I had an outbreak of "something" in the tank with all the plants which I stripped down and now the plants are in a bucket. I'm not sure what to do with them, I medicated for ich and also added pimafix. I googled the blue rams and apparently they are happiest in a pH 5.5 to 6.5, does anyone here know if that's the case? If so I am in trouble... My tap water is 7.4 to 7.8 and the bettas learn to cope mostly. I add blackwater extract which really doesn't make much difference. I would love to hear any suggestions from you guys that have kept these magnificent little fish. Should I evict the betta girl and try to drop the pH? I imagine that the lower pH will be a pain to maintain in my area. That said I want to do the right thing by my new babies. I look forward to any and all advice/suggestions. Thanks, Tracey. PS Merry Christmas everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie Posted December 20, 2009 Report Share Posted December 20, 2009 What a great present! IMO you're better off with acclimatised fish in non-ideal pH than messing around trying to make the pH "ideal" and having it swing all over the place (IME). I had a pair of rams spawn once in a community tank I just used 7.8 tap water in, if that helps. Alternatively you could add IAL or peat to the water, which I find more effective than blackwater extract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anasfire Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 MY suggestion would be to add large shell grit to the tank's gravel, that should lower the ph some. I have some mixed into the gravel in my 3.4ft and I kept butterfly rams in there quite happily. They even spawned a few times for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 I'm pretty sure shell grit increases ph, rather than reducing it... Still, shouldn't stop them spawning! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anasfire Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 oh yeah of course it does hahaha i keep forgetting lowering means making more acidic! you can see how much care i take in maintaining ph in my tanks...NONE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billphil Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Normal blue rams are pretty hardy creatures and will be happy over a wide range of water conditions. However if they are electric blue rams (just recently in the Australian hobby) you will need tor educe the pH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rod Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 (edited) Sure you will need soft acid water if you want to breed rams and get the eggs to hatch.....but If you are keeping them for display then it's far better to focus on keeping the water quality high (Good filtration,plants in the tank and regular water changes) and feed quality food......than it is to play chemist. Rams will live very happily and breed in tap water....but my experience is fertility of eggs is poor unless water is soft and unlike some other dwarfs chances of them raising fry in a community tank are nil! Ph is only part of water chemistry....if you have hard water then ph will be difficult to lower....as the carbonate hardness buffers the water and will negate the chemicals added....so you add more chemicals ....eventually you win but chances are you will have a ph crash and all the fish will die so buying "ph down" from the lfs to solve your concerns is not a Good answer in my opinion. If you want low ph you first need soft water....low Total dissolved solids ,Low Kh (carbonate hardness) then peat and ketapang leaves have a better chance of reducing ph......To soften water add water that contains little or no chemicals....ie rainwater. This will be absolutely necessary to breed and raise fry but not necessary and a tad risky for the Novice. Post photos....I'd be Happy to sex them for you Here's a pair...male on the right...female with the pink tummy Edited December 21, 2009 by Rod Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anasfire Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Ohhhh they are so beautiful! I want some! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlc33 Posted December 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Thanks to everyone for your advice. Rod I will try to get photos when they come out of hiding. I put the lights on for the first time today ( Got them last Friday). They are yet to come out of hiding - one behind some plants and one has found a gap under the sponge filter. I am thinking of changing filtration system to a floss and carbon job soon. I took a water sample to the lfs and pH was high as we know but they also said general hardness was off the scale. I am not sure whether they are referring to kH or something else. I don't have any trouble getting DW liquid or shampoo to lather??? Lilli I like you prefer not to muck about trying to make massive adjustments to water parameters, I would end up in a straight jacket, after someone found me on the floor rocking back and forth and sucking my thumb near the tanks! Cass when your son gets older maybe he will get you some for chrissie lol. I am still unsure as to what to do with my plants. At the moment they are in a bucket that has the treated water in it ie ichonex sp? and pimafix. I would like to add them back to the tank but do I need to rinse them or do anything to them? By the way my rams are supposed to look like Rod's, they don't have as strong colouration but I think they are still adjusting or trying to. Another questions comes to mind... What do they like to eat? The guy at the lfs said just to give them any flake I had at home - I get so mad when they say stuff like that! I have tried the flake, also FD blackworm and frozen bloodworm. The betta girl loves it all. I haven't actually seen them eat anyting as yet. I am hoping that when I move away from the tank they come out and have a go at the food. Anyway thanks again and I look forward to learning more about these guys through all of your knowledge. Tracey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie Posted December 21, 2009 Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Do you have grindal worms, Tracey? Or access to live blackworms, to get them eating? I'm surprised they haven't followed the female betta's lead. Keith Hand (Handsfree) is in WA and often has grindal starters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlc33 Posted December 21, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2009 Lilli, one of them I noticed is eating flake that sinks. Neither of them are prepared to leave the bottom of the tank at this stage. I will pm handsfree to see what I can get, but he hasn't been on the site for ages that I have noticed. Another thing I have seen is that the one that is hiding behind the plants seems to have an eye problem. This little fish is much paler all over than the other and one of its eyes looks shriveled and dead. Also it does not have the black stripe over that eye. It is quite difficult to get a good look and it would be impossible to get a photo at this stage. Looking in the freezer I also have daphnia so I will give that a try. The betta girl is gonna think it's christmas! (pun intended). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlc33 Posted December 22, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 sry all gonna bump this this just once. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuckie Posted December 22, 2009 Report Share Posted December 22, 2009 I was wondering if you put a mirror beside the tank so they think there are 4 rams (not just 2), if that might make them a bit more confident? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tlc33 Posted December 23, 2009 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2009 That's an interesting suggestion Lilli, thanks. I will let you know how that works out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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