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large pectoral fins


maddzvk
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OK I cant find where I read it

but a while ago when I was looking at a betta breeding forum

someone said that 'big ear' and 'elephant ear'/'dumbo' both referred to enlarged pectorals but were not the same

has any one else come across this?

cause also on aquabid i had a look and some breeders are using both terms but the big ears do seem to be smaller (if they use both terms)

for example these two are from bettaakapes

one is named big ear (the first) and the one is named elephant ear/dumbo

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashmp&1361683227

http://www.aquabid.com/cgi-bin/auction/auction.cgi?fwbettashmp&1361683164

anyway do people think they are a term for the same thing or do you think breeders have tried to seperate the two 'classes' of larger pectorals

(i know theres no dumbo standard, but there are tentative ones around on the malaysian forums and im noticing alot of the big ear/dumbo are far off them. im gonna start a thread on these tentative ones tonight too)

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one of the big ear/dumbo breeders in Malaysia is our master, Bobby Chua. From what I understand, currently he is also developing new strains of this big pectoral variety. Below are some attempts from him to define "Big Ear" and "Dumbo". Bear in mind that even Bobby himself mentioned that this is for discussion and nothing is set in stone ie. this is not the absolute definition nor an official standard. However, I feel that if most of use Malaysian hobbyists/breeders can agree to this definition, we can widely use this proposal as a guide to define "Big Ear" and "Dumbo". And if we have a Big Ear/Dumbo class in Competitions, we can refer to this as a guideline to set our standards.

taken from http://www.bettamalaysia.com/mybb/showthread.php?tid=380

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10150788985823766&set=o.189679344393346&type=3&theater

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http://www.arofanati...d.php?p=9064913

more proof of people trying to define the two in malaysia

i thought i was making it up but hard core googling backed me up better than i thought it would.

i know someone posted a longfin HM 'dumbo' the other day and it made me really sad cause its ears were tiny hardly any larger than normal it was sold to them as a 'HM big ear" but they thought dumbo and big ear were the same thing so the called it dumbo anyway got me thinking cause theres some pretty dubious 'dumbos' eg these two http://z7.invisionfr...rs/ar/t5612.htm

oh also there is no IBC standards for dumbos yet cause its so new.

but a fair few breeders in malaysia try to differentiate between them.

Edited by maddzvk
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Interesting topic - and you're right, the mutation is very new, and still to be worked out in terms of the problems that are inherent with the mutation.

As far as I understand it has several "colloquial" terms used to describe the fins, but Dumbo/Elephant Ears/Big Ears all refer to the same style of mutation.

There is no class in it for IBC as yet as the newness and the irregularity make it impossible to judge.

I also wonder if they will develop a class for it at all, as some of the mutations don't warrant acknowledgment (i.e. combtail is not accepted, nor would elephant ears be)

It'll be interesting to see.

Also interesting to see how this trait breeds out - we still haven't had anyone (to my knowledge) have a successful big ears x big ears, thusfar I believe it to be recessive.

Am i rite?

Dunnoh.

-Ness

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i made two other posts on bettas one in betta critique (couldve gone into standards but didnt want to ) called 'dumbo standard' and one in genetics 'breeding dumbos'. mostly its a mix of other forums, internet skills and some personal knowledge compiled. I think it makes sense to have a distiction between the pectoral sizes but doesnt mean it will be practical or widely adhered too so go figure... doesnt need an IBC standard. like james said with half moons and over half moons it the same gene but there is definately a difference and doesnt only HM have an IBC standard since OHM is 'undesirable' anyway?

From reading i think some of the overseas breeders feel that way about having these smaller finned fish being sold under the same name as ones with fins almost twice the size.

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  • 1 year later...

I am currently on the hunt for dumbo to do some hard core breeding and picture taking to try and get some first hand info out there on how well they go together, what deformites etc come about and all that. Hope to get enough soon and well feed for slow controlled breeding over winter and spring. Will keep everyone posted once I have enough fish to start it all

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check out the other two topics as well. especially 'breeding dumbos'
i spoke to a few americans about their lines of enlarged pectoralled fish as well
even extravagent bettas guys over a year ago i asked and they were the ones who said they had 14 sellable fry though most of them were assymetrical in colour if not size (didnt make them reconsider continuing dumbo to dumbo breeding though so not too severe).
anyway theres much more info available now than when i posted this over a year ago :) (including an ibc standard(trial standard))

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