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StephanieBell

Mystery Betta Disease

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Hi everyone.

This is my first post. I'm not sure whats wrong with my Betta. He's my first fish and just a store bought VT. He lives in a 13 litre heated and filtered tank. Temp 29 degrees. I've tested water myself and had It tested a pet store (the just use the same kit as me, but nowhere else does it) and water is fine. PH is 6.5. He's acting fairly normal; eating well, building bubble nest etc. He has been darting about and swimming away from me and hiding when I get close to the tank (maybe because I've been annoying him with the torch) but not scratching or rubbing on anything.

For a few months his pec fins have become kind of shiny white/yellow (used to be pretty much transparent) and have become kind of chunky with little lumps of tissue on them. I have no idea what this is! Googled it soo many times! I treated with Tri Sulfa thinking that it may be fin rot. It didn't work.

His other fins have become much more raggedy in the past month or so but it doesnt look like fin rot to me, although I'm no expert. His fins dont look like they're rotting or bleeding or dark around the edges.

This week he has white small white patches (not spots) in the middle of his tail and around his gills and mouth. I'm thinking maybe cotton mouth? Or fungus?

I also noticed that he has a sort of metalic brown colored area on his anal fin close to his body. When I shine a light on him. Is this velvet?

The visible symptoms seem to be getting worse, but he's acting fine! I've bough everything I can find from the pet stores in my town and called the vets but they cannot help me. I didn't think it was white spot but I treated him with a white spot remedy once over 3 days anyway thinking that it may fix it or help treat it if it was another parasite. I was also treating with Tri sulfa at the time. He's now had 2 x 3 day treatments of Tri sulfa. And I am currently treating him with multi cure (I've changed the water after the white spot treatment) which I don't really like because of the staining and I don't think it's very effective but I can't find anything else that treats velvet (I don't even know if that's what he has).

Whatever it is I think maybe it's not advanced enough to tell.

Any ideas? I've read about salt baths but I've never done one and I'm scared to because I don't know what I'm doing!

I have some photos that I took about 4 days ago but you can't really see it properly. The white patches aren't really visible in the photos, as they have got worse since then. He darts and hides and gets really stressed when I come up to the glass with my phone (to take a photo). Sorry they probably aren't much help at all but I don't want to upset him too much.

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Ponyo1.jpg

Ponyo.jpg

Edited by Steph90

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When you say the water is fine. What are the exact parameters?

A picture would defiantly help. That does sound like velvet though.

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Thanks for your reply! I really appreciate the help. I'm feeling a bit helpless because I don't know what else to do or who to ask for advice.

I've just re-tested everything.

PH 6.5

GH 60

KH 80

Nitrite 0

Nitrate 0

Ammonia 0

Does velvet explain the white patches and the raggedy fins and lumpy pec fins? Do you think he has multiple diseases?

If it is velvet what can I use to treat him? Other than what I am already doing.

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Do you have plants in there and how often do you perform water changes. The zero nitrates seem a bit odd.

When they get velvet their fins will clamp together, Are the white patches fluffy like a fungus? Or like small dots? I can't see from the picture. It certainly looks like velvet. Try raising the temperature to 32 and adding salt, you'll need to look up dosages online. Hope he gets better for you.

Triple sul

Triple sulphur is for bacterial issues. Velvet is a protozoan so it wouldn't be effective against that.

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I only have silk plants in the tank.

The white stuff doesn't look furry or anything and it's really shiny and the patches aren't circular. The are almost rectangular shaped. so maybe it's velvet that's white not rust coloured??

I used a test strip to test for the GH KH Nitrate and Nitrite and the liquid tests for the PH and Ammonia. I've been told that the strips aren't too accurate. Or maybe it's because his tank is filled with rain water. We don't have town water to our house, we have a rain water tank.

I have this salt stuff called conditioning salts which is what the pet store told me to use. Is this the same as aquarium salts? I never trust what they tell me.

Do you suggest that I continue with the Tri Sulfa and Multicure?

I do a full water change once a week, but over Christmas I went on holidays and the water wasn't changed for almost 2 weeks. When I got back I had algae and the water was pretty alkaline.

Oh and I haven't noticed clamped fins.

Edited by Steph90

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I had something sort of similiar and it was pobably sheer luck and coincedence but I changed from tap water to rain water and the problem seemed to disappear. Just a comment..there are plenty of people on here with heaps more 'knowledge backed' help..but hey if all else fails....maybe? :blink:

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I don't see anything wrong with the fish and nothing you described sounds alarming aside from the lumpy parts and white parts, full water changes and the heap of meds you've been giving him without even knowing what the problem is. Would you let your doctor pump you full of meds without a proper diagnosis?

The colour changing could simply be from him maybe having marble genes, but I would disregard it anyway. Your fish definitely does not have columnaris (cotton mouth, saddle back, mouth fungus, and the various other names) and I highly doubt it has velvet or it would be half dead already and visibly effected if he had it for that long. He would also be scratching.

You sound like you've freaked out at something innocent and just used a bazillion meds on him (triple sulpha, white spot meds, multi cure... anything else?) which can cause enough issues on it's own.

I think you probably just need to leave him alone. Start adding salt (aquarium salt, 1 teaspoon per 10lt - add an initial dose based on your water volume and from then on only replace what you take out through water changing) to your tank and do weekly 30% water changes as regular maintenance. You could also add some melafix or indian almond leaf for it's antibacterial properties.

If you are still concerned then put the fish in a smaller container and get clear pictures of the lumpy/white parts. He'll get over it.

Edited by Yan

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Thanks for all the responses.

His tank is already filled with rainwater. We don't have access to town water here, as we live out of town, so we get our water from a rainwater tank.

I probably have over reacted a bit. As I said it's my first fish, I have had him for about a year but there's still a lot that I don't know and it's scary when you see changes and you're not experienced with fish diseases etc. Thanks also for the tip on how much water to change.

I'll leave him alone I think and see how he goes! Wish me luck!

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I'm not sure if you mentioned you had had him for a year earlier or if I missed it, but if that's the case then he's getting on in age and they do lose condition as they get older. If he does start acting out of character (lethargic, not eating, anything like that) or rubbing his sides or gills on anything then let us know but I honestly think there's probably nothing wrong with him. :)

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Sounds like good intentions, just keep an eye on him, feed him at the front of the tank, and try to take some clear shots (with the macro setting on) of the patches your indicating.

Unfortunately these little dudes don't last very long - so it could be age creeping up - or, you could be on to something.

Look for altered finnage, clamping is a give away as Matt said.

Indian Almond Leaf is priceless when it comes to keeping betta - it's great to help them boos their immune systems.

Keep us posted please & good luck

-Ness

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Thanks again for the replies.

I will keep an eye on him and see how he goes! He's still acting normal so that's a good sign. I didn't even think about the age factor. I knew they didn't live long but now I think about it he is a bit of an old man!

I just discovered Indian almond leaf on the forum yesterday. I'd never heard of it before that. It's great to finally have access to some good information and tips on keeping Bettas. I didn't know where to get some so I bought some off eBay.

I will keep you up to date on how he is going. I'm sure if there is something wrong with him it will get worse and be more visable and easier to diagnose.

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His fins are worse today :(

I stopped treatment on Monday night and replaced the carbon in my filter to see how he would go. Last night he looked the same and this morning when I woke up I his fins look find of frayed / shredded. This happened overnight!

He still has white patches on his tail but I can't get a clear shot. They haven't changed.

Tested the water (I've been checking it daily). Still exactly the same as last time.

PH 6.5

GH 60

KH 80

Nitrite 0

Nitrate 0

Ammonia 0

Another really crap photo:

Sorry I couldn't get a better one. He really doesn't like me at the moment (unless I'm giving him food). When he saw me trying to take a photo he jumped out of the water (lucky my tank is covered) and then went and hid. It really scared me.

photo-7.jpg

What the hell is this? Is it fin rot now? It's really making me angry and I'm ready to give up!

I really don't want to use anymore medications, I feel like I'm going to overdose him and kill him! What's everyone's opinion on a salt bath (I've never done one before) I've added salt to the water already.

Should I leave it or do something?

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Could he be damaging it on something in his tank or getting his fins stuck to the filter? Filter type, got any ornaments in there (plastic plants in particular)? If not then move onto an anti-bacterial like tetracycline.

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When do you get your IAL? I can post you a few leaves if it's quicker. I love IAL.

Nothing new to add, would follows Yans advice. good luck.

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I only have a silk plant. I will take it out just in case. I have a plastic castle and a bridge ornament. He goes inside of both all the time. Don't think there are any sharp bits on them. It could be the filter. I have one of those flow over filters. So it hangs on the side of the tank (externally) and the water gets sucked up the tube thing and the water flows back into the tank. He could have possibly got his fins stuck in the tubey bit.

I'll try and find tetracycline. The pet stores here are really crap for aquarium stuff!

IAL will probably be weeks. It's coming from Singapore I think. I would absolutely love if you could send me some! Can you PM me about it or something? Still getting used to using the site.

Thanks Yan and Busman

Edited by Steph90

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Hmm, I believe I had this with Echo once, my male crowntail betta, I thought it was just velvet, he survived with warm water and nice clean tank. :)

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I treated him with Tetracycline but I don't have a hospital tank so I treated him in his main tank.

I'm not sure if it has worked or not it is sort of hard to tell. But I'm pretty sure I have completely stuffed up the cycle by adding the antibiotics. I had been checking the water daily and it had been fine but I checked it today after skipping a few days and the ammonia was pretty high (1ppm). I added this ACE stuff to remove the ammonia but I'm not really sure what to do about getting my tank back in working order. I have some Stress Zyme which I have added. Is this going to help? Does anyone have another idea? I can't remove him from the tank because I have nowhere else to put him at the moment (in the process of setting up a new tank but I still have to buy lots of stuff).

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I hate it when the fish get sick, it can get really fiddley if you don't have a hospital setup like me.

He had it in his main tank.

Hmm, I cant really help you with this one. :(

I'm sure an expert will see this soon enough. On an other note he is very handsome. :D

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You could add Seachem Stability to get the filter going again just let it cycle slowly by itself. Keep up with water changes and the fish should be fine.

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