Feeding Fry Mw Or Ve

30 posts in this topic

Posted

Hi guys. I need a step by step instruction on what to do with micro worms & vinegar eel. I haven't had my first spawn yet, but I want to make sure I'm fully prepared. So if anyone could give me some advice, starting at the very begining & assuming I know NOTHING (because I don't) on what to do with these, that would be fantatsic! Thanks everyone.

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Posted

I don't know about other suppliers, but if you purchase your cultures from Fighters4U, she will send them with very clear and easy to follow instructions. :D

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Posted

Oh great! That's who I'm looking to buy from. I've sent her an email, just waiting a reply. I feel heaps better now. Thanks for that!

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Posted

do you mean how to culture them, or how to feed them?

There are many threads on the forum on both topics - have you tried a search of the forum?

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Posted

Right, well my own quick search wasn't terribly productive, so here is a 20 second run down of how I feed these things:

MW: when the worms are crawling up the sides, use a damp (not dripping) flat artist's paint brush to sweep them off the sides, then rinse into a cup of the fry's tank water. Swirl the water to suspend the worms, then drip throughout the fry tank with a small dripper/eyedropper/baster.

VE: Get a piece of densely woven fabric such as chamois about 20cm square (or a water-permeable paper dust mask). Get a funnel. Line the funnel with the chamois. Put it over a cup. Get a baster, suck up a baster full of VE culture from the top of a culture that has been developing long enough that you have clouds of VE in it. Strain through the chamois. Tip the liquid back into the culture (there will still be eels in it). Swish the chamois into the fry tank (don't worry about rinsing, have never been a problem for me) and ideally suspend it in the tank so the fry can pick the eels trapped in the fabric off.

You should have multiple cultures going so that when you use the inhabitants of one, there is a fresh one to harvest from next time and the first one gets a chance to recuperate.

Make sure you order your cultures early - like, at least 2 weeks before needed - so they really get going well before you have fry. A starter culture isn't the best thing to harvest from immediately. You ideally want the cultures densely populated to maximise the numbers of nematodes you feed the fry. Harvesting repeatedly from your starter culture will deplete it very quicky and your future yields will be poor.

Also don't feed either of these foods too long, MW are throught to be related to absence of ventrals, and also IME fry grow way faster if you introduce bbs, then mosquito rafts, then grindal worms then FD blackworm or chopped bloodworm as soon as you can, and discontinue the former feeds following a brief transition (for the littlies/slow learners).

Lately I have used VE in preference to MW, as fry swim at the top and so do these nematodes whereas MW sink and may go uneaten. Best growth results ever. I understand MW is more nutritious but firstly, it's not nutritious if it doesn't get eaten and secondly, I only feed either for about 3 days then introduce bbs anyway.

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Posted

WOW Lilli, that was probably the most informative 20 second run down I've read yet. You've obviously done this a fair bit and tried & tested a lot of different methods, procedures, cultures etc.

What if you don't have Mosquito rafts and/or Grindal worms... would you then proceed to the FD blackworm and/or frozen bloodworm or would you continue with the bbs for a little longer. I've got a 4 week old spawn currently feeding solely on bbs but I know they are ready for something new however I've not been able to get any mosquito rafts happening (stupid I know... I live in mosquito heaven??? :D) and I've no idea where to get Grindal worm. They are really growing well on the bbs but I notice after every feed they (there's only 8 of them) seem to display SBD symptons. They don't have this problem normally, it's just after feeding. When would be best time to introduce ground up adult food?

Linley

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Posted

I am concerned by the SBD symptoms you're describing. I'd really want to get them off bbs asap in those circumstances.

when you can introduce new foods is completely dictated by the size of the fry. You can always try a bit of ground up adult food and see if they take it, but start with just the smallest pinch of it, or if they don't eat it you'll just pollute the tank. feed it before you add the bbs, when they're hungry. PeterJ uses MW instead of bbs as apparently the nutritionaly values of both are similar so that's an option for you too (just watch those ventrals!).

re your mozzie raft issue - want to start a separate thread and explain what you're doing so we can try and work out why you're not having any success? :lol: You might even want to post in one of the existing mozzie raft threads (we only need so many threads about them :D )

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Posted

Whoa. Information overload! That's the most informative 20 seconds I think I've ever spent! lol But what I'm gathering is, if I am going to buy some MW or VE I should be getting more than one batch of each? Or can I divide them when I get them?

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Posted

IMO I don't think it's necessary to purchase more than one culture of each. I got (what I call) a mother culture of each going and then once established sub-cultured them.

I usually have 4 x mw cultures on the go at any one time... I keep at least one older culture going (so long as it has plenty of worms still) incase the newer cultures don't take... and I always take two sub-cultures just for the 'just incase scenarios" ie. cat jumps on them, dogs eat them, they get infested with maggots etc. Once the cultures are no longer viable and/or go black and/or rank, then I chuck them out.

I have a 'stock' solution of the ve in a pail (with a lid) and from that I sub-culture into bottles as required.

Remember, these are generally first foods and as such will only be required for a few days... I'd be inclined to ensure your up to speed with bbs hatching and harvesting :hug: .

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Posted

BBS hatching? Great! Sounds hard & let me guess, I've gotta but a set up for that?

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Posted

Now, I know there are stickies about bbs hatching methods :hug:

I agree with muthaof5, you only need one starter culture, and you sub-culture your own from there. There are articles on the aaq home page about setting up both VE and MW cultures.

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Posted

If you NEED the culture straight away, try and get an established one rather than a starter as you can harvest from that immediately and use it to subculture.

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Posted

hmmmm thinks she should consider selling established cultures as well as starters......

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Posted

Now would -they- come in boxes? :-D

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Posted

in a container, the one I matured them in...... those takeaway containers are pretty much watertight and I could then place that into a zip lock bag to contain spillage... I think I'm gonna do it...but now to work out how much to charge for it... I charge $10 for a starter kit with everything u need so a mature culture... $15...would anyone pay that for a culture that's ready to go as soon as u get it? No waiting around for it to mature so you can use it?

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Posted

Postage is on top of that, right? Since people don't have to buy more one more than once, it's not too bad.

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Posted

yeah express postage on top of that and even better than not having to by more than one, you can use it as soon as it arrives rather than having to wait! how awesome will that be hehe

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Posted

I've no idea where to get Grindal worm.

There's a QFAS auction next Saturday. They're tons of fun and you can almost always get grindals, mw etc. there cheap, and there's no postage.

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Posted

I'd pay $15 coz I have no idea what am doing & if I can't get it right I'd be stuck with hungry fry & no feed!

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Posted

There's a QFAS auction next Saturday. They're tons of fun and you can almost always get grindals, mw etc. there cheap, and there's no postage.

Thanks PeterJ... I had intended on checking out the Caboolture one held a couple of weeks ago... but forgot :sad:,

BBS hatching? Great! Sounds hard & let me guess, I've gotta but a set up for that?

BBS is not as hard as it looks :confused: , and you only need a 1.5 or 2L soft drink bottle, some airline, a pump and a syringe (depending upon size will cost 10 to 30 cents from your pharmacy).

here's the site I used to set up one of my hatcheries. It's explained step-by-step from set-up to harvesting.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=AU&hl=...p;v=7uNkHPuGaqo

I'm also using this one as I couldn't be bothered with the whole airline through the lid thing again.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PiwzPA7Vrbg

either does the job well. :D

I filter mine through a tea bag (need to open it up, fold into quarters and place in a funnel), rinse off with some tank water, discard the rinsate, then wash off the filter paper with some tank water into a small container then scatter over the tank. I know some just add directrly to the tank and others leave the filtering media in the tank, but this method works for me ^_^

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Posted

IME the chinese takeaway containers do leak, even when closed properly (and you don't want to have to navigate a slimy smelly leaky tub out of a ziplock bag you get in the post, LOL!) . I'd suggest a jar with a screw top, if you're going to be transporting a larger quantity. Maybe a plastic one, to minimise weight? Postage may increase if you're posting a heavier quantity.

A friend told me about using pop-top water bottles for VE. When you pop the top closed it's watertight for transport/postage etc, and when they arrive home you pop it open. The pop-top keeps other creatures out but lets air in. Might be a viable way to transport a culture. Hope that helps!

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Posted

Why not use well washed out 600ml softdrink bottles or water bottles?

I received an aquatic plant sent in a 600ml water bottle - it was wrapped in about 8 sheets of newspaper and a double layer of bubble wrap in an express post bag and got here perfectly ok. The bottle had about 150ml of water in it to keep the plant happy and hydrated. All under 500g in weight.

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Posted

Yeah, not sure I'm gonna sell mature VE cultures.... just MW for now coz the postage on the VE would be through the roof! Any with VE you need to use them as soon as you get them anyway for the first 2 weeks so that should sustain any spawn until they can take MW....that's my theory anyway.

And to keep to the relevance of this post.... using VE, I strain them through a coffee filter then open it up at the seams and rinse it well in a jug of water, then gently trickle that through the fry tank so not to give them a swirly or shock them with cold water into their heated tank lol

With MW I just use a finger and run it along the inside of the container to collect worms from the walls then swish the finger through the tank or into some tank water in a cup and then spread that through the tank

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Posted

So can I plz ask everyone's personal opinon, how long would you or do you feed MW or VE then baby brine?

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Posted

I'm only new to this myself, so I have only 2 spawns to draw experience from. I fed both only mw & ve for 2 days, then introduced bbs with the mx & ve until I saw all the babies had orange tummies. My first spawn took a couple of days, and my second spawn one day... I then stopped feeding the mw & ve altogether and just fed bbs.

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